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Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico (Read 191,744 times)
crackerclicker
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #45 - Aug 20th, 2011 at 10:22pm
 
Tom Roberts wrote on Aug 20th, 2011 at 9:58pm:
For ATS they say adjustable limited by PC memory


oops, yeah i missed that one.  shouldn't have since it is actually not a minor misstep on their part.

Tom Roberts wrote on Aug 20th, 2011 at 9:58pm:
The Verus PC resources are also quite limited...not enough to even run a Pico when you step on the gas


it's a good thing you mention that since i see people quote using the pico on the verus quite often.

Tom Roberts wrote on Aug 20th, 2011 at 9:58pm:
More on the ATS scope discussion here:


oops, again.  i gotta try to keep from mixing up the threads  Smiley.
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #46 - May 15th, 2012 at 11:20am
 
Lazy as I am, I did not take the time to calculate all this plethora of information, so it could be but into the sample rate calculator:

http://www.sealey.co.uk/PLPageBuilder.asp?gotonode=ViewProduct&method=mViewProdu...
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #47 - May 15th, 2012 at 3:29pm
 
PicoFin,

That is just a rebadged Hantek scope.

These are a very poor substitute for a PicoScope and not even in the same league.  You can start a new thread on these if you want.  This thread is about Pico vs Snap-On scopes.
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #48 - May 16th, 2012 at 3:35pm
 
After purchasing and using a pico scope i had the chance to try the modis. i almost gave up on it before it booted up. but over all if you know the tool your using (both good points and bad) you can be successful. it's when you exceed or underestimate the tools capabilities that you run into trouble. Wink
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #49 - May 16th, 2012 at 4:00pm
 
pct wrote on May 16th, 2012 at 3:35pm:
when you exceed or underestimate the tools capabilities that you run into trouble.


Yes indeed.  I would say over estimate though.   WinkKnowing the instruments limitations is essential to be able to work within them.

I would say that most experienced scope users, when they get hold of a PicoScope, underestimate the tools capabilities.  There is some un-learning that needs to be done to realize that what was impossible is now possible.   Cool

New PicoScope software is coming which boosts the performance of the hardware again making PicoScope now 1000 times more powerful than the Snap-On scopes.  Single channel captures of 100 seconds can be done at a real time sample rate of 1MS/sec collecting a hundred million samples on a single screen.  Shocked

This is now appearing in the current 6.7.x beta release.  The same 4423/4223 scope hardware is up to 10 times more powerful.  Now that's a pretty cool free upgrade.   Cool

We are not recommending this software for field use but this is where things are going and these capabilities will soon be in a release version.
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« Last Edit: Feb 15th, 2013 at 4:02pm by Tom Roberts »  

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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #50 - May 23rd, 2012 at 7:54am
 
Tom Roberts wrote on May 15th, 2012 at 3:29pm:
PicoFin,

That is just a rebadged Hantek scope.

These are a very poor substitute for a PicoScope and not even in the same league.  You can start a new thread on these if you want.  This thread is about Pico vs Snap-On scopes.



Tom, I just thought that all of the competition does not need its own thread. I did not know it as a rebadge, nor am I familiar with a Hantek, but a low price usually alerts me for a bogus product. I actually just thought if this was a new player in the field, that someone took the time to investigate its real specs and maybe put them into the sample rate calc to see where it reaches.. BTW, is the Hantek already in the chart on the website comparing scopes?

I am one of the lucky ones that just bought a Pico without much investigation, and found out later I did strike gold, as I just actually wanted to upgrade from a Fluke 123 handheld to a bigger screen  Smiley
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #51 - May 23rd, 2012 at 8:26am
 
I'm not going to say much here so as not to derail this thread as it is about Snap-On comparison not Hantek.  It's much better if each subject has its own thread.  Makes things easier to find and follow.  I won't respond to any more Hantek discussion here.  I will say this much...

The Hantek scope is indeed a bogus product that does not perform as claimed.  This is also a company that pirated much of the content from Pico's automotive library and put it in their software.  Other accessories and hardware have also been copied.  Support is non-existent.

From what I understand, Sealey is a reputable company.  I can't explain why they are selling a Chinese clone.  Perhaps they did not do proper research.   Huh

These Hantek idiots tried to recruit me.   Grin
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #52 - May 23rd, 2012 at 11:55am
 
Fair enough. Nothing more really needs to be said.  Angry
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #53 - Jun 5th, 2012 at 9:57pm
 
I am in need of both a scope and scanner, and for the past month have been examining the differences between Autonerdz Deluxe 4-Channel Kit and Snap On's Verus. I attached a spreadsheet highlighting the differences that were important to me. I'm not posting this to start any arguments, and I'm sure some will disagree or have something to say about one of my pros/cons. This is simply what was important to me, and I thought by posting it, it might be of some use to someone else in my position. The price for the Verus is the non-wireless, and the price for the Pico is Autonerdz Deluxe Kit $3,300, a $400 laptop, and Snap-On's Solus Ultra $3,900.

I also must add that one of the big pros for me is the quick response I have received from both Tom and Brian, answering my never-ending questions! Their knowledge and patience is extensive. Ever talk to a Snap-On Rep? I have yet to speak with one that knows anything about scopes. If the person selling you the product doesn't know anything about it, where do you turn for answers?

And with that said, I of course have a few questions. Tom: you were referring to Snap-On scopes, what do you mean by this?

Tom Roberts wrote on Jan 29th, 2011 at 7:14pm:
It's still the most powerful native hand held automotive scope IMHO.


Secondly, I was watching a video of ScannerDanner testing a CKP hall-effect sensor using a Vantage Pro. He shows that by graphing the min/max frequency you can see drop outs or glitches much easier than graphing the square wave form. Can anyone comment on the Picoscope/software having this function or something similar? If not, what would you do in this case? Below is a link to the video. You can skip to 6:35 to see him use this method.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzZNlPosGSY&feature=plcp
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #54 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 2:43am
 
CW, you have answered your own question,
get it from some one who knows the product

bet that snap on man is still waiting for the vantage/verus to boot up, but while he waits for that he can tell you a thing or 2 about hand tools, thats his expertise.

i had/have a vantage pro,dont use it at all now, got the 4 channel deluxe pico from auto nerdz, the sections on this site that autonerdz members have acsess to has ALOT of Tech stuff which is well worth getting, this is probably best purchase of tool i have ever had  due to ease of use, support, expansion of knowledge etc. with my exchange rate, tax and freight it makes it alot dearer than you guys in N America get it for, but it is way worth it!!
Plus like you said Tom and Brian reply swiftly to your questions and mine, that shows dedication

PS, In my shop id be annoyed if i wanted to use the scope on the verus and another tech was using the scanner function, i think having 2 tools in one is more of a pain than it is good.
lets face it there isnt much out there now that you dont use a scanner for, so when will you get to use the scope if the scanners is always in use? Smiley
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #55 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 7:24am
 
CW, where in Denver are you at?  I am in the Arvada area and run a Pico 4 channel and Solus Pro.  Maybe you could check out the Pico in person and see what you think.  Contact me through the PM at the top of the page if you like.

Sam
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #56 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 8:30am
 
CW wrote on Jun 5th, 2012 at 9:57pm:
Secondly, I was watching a video of ScannerDanner testing a CKP hall-effect sensor using a Vantage Pro. He shows that by graphing the min/max frequency you can see drop outs or glitches much easier than graphing the square wave form. Can anyone comment on the Picoscope/software having this function or something similar? If not, what would you do in this case? Below is a link to the video. You can skip to 6:35 to see him use this method.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzZNlPosGSY&feature=plcp



I consider myself quite a newbie on this Pico-thing, but my first thought was that you can take the capture you want, even save it as a PSD file, and if you afterwards notice you did not do this trick, open the .psd file in your Pico software, on the bottom of the screen "Add measurement", "whole trace" on the channel where you have your desired signal, let the measurement function show you Frequency and there you have it. It will show you min, max and average values in numerical format. For the application you desired, I don't know if it is for any diagnostic value to see a Hz trace (or is there, seeing a drop in Hz on higher rpm, that still is not the lowest Hz in the trace..???) You also have a dozen of other measurements you could play around with. More experienced users, please correct me if I'm wrong..


Btw, have you downloaded the Pico Automotive software on your computer? If not, please do, when you start the program it suggest you to a demo mode if it does not detect a Pico scope connected to the PC. There you can play around a little for free.
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #57 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 9:11am
 
CW,

CW wrote on Jun 5th, 2012 at 9:57pm:
what do you mean by this?



I meant the Snap-On Verus/Modis are the most powerful native hand held four channel automotive scope available at this time.  By native hand held I mean an integrated platform all in one scope and screen.

They can even out perform some PC based scopes like the Escope.  To advance beyond the SO scopes you really have to go with a Pico.

CW wrote on Jun 5th, 2012 at 9:57pm:
Can anyone comment on the Picoscope/software having this function or something similar?


The 4000 series scopes can graph frequency live on one channel at a time.  You can also just not bother with this....capture four channels of data and then apply one or more frequency math channels to any of the active channels.  This will add an additional channel to the display that graphs the frequency and can sure help you locate the area of interest in a long capture time.


With a little more math you can also make an RPM channel.  With other math functions you can do all kinds of things you would never be able to do with a Snap-On scope.

Here is an example:

http://www.autonerdz.com/cgi/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1308802930/

To address a couple of your cons in the Pico list:

Harder to resell:   

This has not been my observation.  The ones I have seen go up for sale don't last long.

Laptop isn't as rugged:

That depends on the laptop.  You can either get a ruggedized laptop or several standard ones for the same $$.  Keep in mind that the Verus is a very minimal PC that resists upgrading.  It does not even have the resources to run a Pico.  Small RAM, low end processor, not even a real OS, etc.  Any modern PC would be way more PC.

Windows based:

Yup, that can be a problem sometimes but Windows 7 is really quite good and light years away from XP Embedded in the Verus.

You are doing the right thing....your homework.  You have narrowed things down to two excellent choices.  It all depends on what kind of techs you have or what kind of techs you want to have.  The SO scopes are somewhat limiting if you have techs that really want to take this LSD thing to the Outer Limits.   Smiley
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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #58 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 9:18am
 
Here's a little tidbit you over looked  Smiley

Snap-On's junk will need to have the yearly updates and it's not cheap.

Pico software updates are FREE and they actually improve the tool, were Snap On updates usually slow the tool down with BLOATWARE.

The Pico software updates are trial tested by us  Cheesy


I can run my Pico on all my PC's and laptops.  Try that with a Snap On tool  Smiley

I have a shop PC, my desktop PC and two mobile laptops.  I can use anyone of these to run my Pico.
If one has a problem, I can use the other one.  What will you do with the Snap On tool.  Two tools in one may sound like a good thing, but if that tool is down, you're ass out  Smiley

Don't be sold on a P.O.S.  by the snap on dealer.  That's his job  Smiley

I'm older and need to use reading glasses to see the screen.  The Snap On screen is a fixed size and it's not easy to see all the detail on a crappy low resolution screen. With the Pico, I capture on my 17 inch laptop monitor and can see the detail really well, but I also use a 24 inch monitor on my shop PC to see even better.  The Pico is exceptionally clear with excellent detail.
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« Last Edit: Jun 6th, 2012 at 9:41am by drdiesel1 »  

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Re: Question of the Month: Verus Vs Pico
Reply #59 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 9:46am
 
I would like to see the Snap On tools image file against this type of output  Smiley
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